大家帮看看最上面的是刚从呱股骨和胫骨骨腔分离出来的细胞,血细胞比较多,后面几张是贴壁的,尤其是瑞氏染色的,能否看见多核状态?第一次做,实在迷茫,无从下手,请大家多多指点!感激不尽了!作者: NBA 时间: 2015-7-11 17:34
谈一下个人总结破骨细胞的内容,仅供楼主参考:
1 破骨细胞的发育来源
破骨细胞的发育来源较为明确,是造血干细胞分化为单核/巨噬细胞后在多种细胞因子 (TNF-a、RANKL、RANK、OPG、M-CSF、PGE2等)的调控下分化为成熟的具有多个细胞核的巨细胞 。
2 破骨细胞的鉴定
破骨细胞呈特异性的抗酒石酸的酸性磷酸酶染色阳性(TRAP+),F-actin染色阳性,表达降钙素受体、组蛋白酶K(cathepsin-k)、整合素αvβ3(integrinsαvβ3),内可以分解骨组织,体外培养可以在骨片、象牙或者人工骨组织培养板上可以形成吸收性陷窝。
3附上几篇关于破骨细胞鉴定的较为权威具体的文献
(1) Chambers, T. J. Regulation of the differentiation and function of osteoclasts. J. Pathol, 2000; 192: 4–13
(2) Boyle, W.J., Simonet, W.S. & Lacey, D.L. Osteoclast differentiation and activation. Nature, 2003; 423: 337–342
(3)Udagawa, N. Takahashi N, Akatsu T,et al. Origin of osteoclasts: mature monocytes and macrophages are capable of differentiating into osteoclasts under a suitable microenvironment prepared by bone marrow-derived stromal cells. Proc. Natl Acad. Sci. USA, 1990;87:7260–7264
(4) Lee SH, Rho J, Jeong D, et al. v-ATPase V0 subunit d2–deficient mice exhibit impaired osteoclast fusion and increased bone formation Nat Med. , 2006; 12:1403 - 1409
(5) Teitelbaum, S., L., and F. P. Ross. Genetic regulation of osteoclast developmentand function. Nat. Rev. Genet,2003;, 8: 638–649.
(6)Teitelbaum, S.L. Bone resorption by osteoclasts. Science,2000;289:1504–1508
4小鼠的破骨细胞TRAP+照片(×100)
Okey, here are the points: mature osteoclasts (OCs) are TRAP postive giant cells with multi-nucei. They share common origin with monocytes/macrophage lineage. In vivo, in bone microenvironment, or in vitro, under suitable conditions, OCs progenitors will be turned into osteoclasts. In the process of differentiation, people usually call monocleated TRAP positive cells as pre-osteoclasts, or osteoclasts precursors.
Hope this would be some help.作者: 雪原 时间: 2015-7-11 17:50
In the first place, I would like to clarify that all the points I listed at 2007-02-06 13:15 are my opinions. Of course, some of fresh cells you isolated are mature osteoclasts, however, there must be many cells which are at pre-osteoclasts (mononuclear cells) stage, although they are TRAP positive too.
In the second place, from my point of view, you can employ both methods to isolate cells from the bones. But, if you isolate cells by using trypsin, the cells may need longer time to recovery.
In conclusion, the cells you harvested will not be pure mature osteoclasts.作者: 雪原 时间: 2015-7-11 17:50
To anwser your questions:
(1) I do not think RANKL mRNA is expressed in osteoclasts. Please double check. To my knowledge, RANKL is expressed in osteoblasts, activated T-cells and activated synovial fibroblasts. Osteoclasts only express RANK.
(2) I do not know how to anwer other of your questions because I do not know the aims of your study. But, you could use the cells once they attached.作者: 雪原 时间: 2015-7-11 17:51
As i mentioned above, osteoclasts are terminal cells which never proliferate, (except their precursors).
And, there is none RANKL expressed on osteoclasts, except its receptor, RANK.
Osteoblasts not only express RANKL, but also osteoprotegerin (OPG).作者: 555444 时间: 2015-7-11 17:52
This is the abstract of that paper (I have the full text of this paper too):
"We examined the role of osteopontin (OPN) in the osteoclastogenesis of arthritis using collagen-induced arthritis (CIA). Cells
from arthritic joints of wild-type (OPN +/+) mice spontaneously developed bone-resorbing osteoclast-like cells (OCLs). The cultured
cells showed an enhanced expression of receptor activator of nuclear factor jB ligand (RANKL) and a decreased expression of
osteoprotegerin (OPG). The addition of OPG reduced the number of OCLs, indicating that the osteoclastogenesis depends on the
RANK/RANKL/OPG system. The cells also produced OPN abundantly and anti-OPN neutralizing antibodies suppressed the
development of OCLs. Moreover, the addition of OPN increased the expression of RANKL and augmented differentiation of OCLs
from OPN-deficient (OPN )/)) cells. OPN, like the combination of 1a,25-dihydroxyvitamin D3 and dexamethasone, also enhanced
the RANKL expression and decreased OPG expression in a stromal cell line, ST2. These results suggest that OPN acts as a positive
regulator in the osteoclastogenesis of arthritis through the RANK/RANKL/OPG system.
2004 Elsevier Inc. All rights reserved."作者: 555444 时间: 2015-7-11 17:53
如果你详细看看上边摘要,就知道在这句话中:"The cultured
cells showed an enhanced expression of receptor activator of nuclear factor jB ligand (RANKL) and a decreased expression of
osteoprotegerin (OPG).","the cultured cells" 没有说是破骨细胞.
如果你再去读该文章的813页,你就彻底明白了:OPN enhances the RANKL expression and suppresses the OPG expression on stromal cells:
Because the harvested cells from joints were a heterogeneous
mixture of cells derived from multiple sources,
such as stromal cells, osteoclast precursors, and lymphocytes,
etc., there are limitations in evaluating mRNA
expression. To clarify the effect of OPN on the expression
of RANKL and OPG, we used a murine stromal
cell line, ST2. As positive control, we used 1,25(OH)2D3
and Dex, which are well-known agents that induce
stromal cells to express RANKL and reduce their expression
of OPG [3,4,8,12,19]. While the combination of.....作者: 雪原 时间: 2015-7-11 17:53
RAW264.7 cells were first used by Hsu et al to generate osteoclasts in vitro (Proc. Natl. Acad. Sci. USA, Vol. 96, pp. 3540–3545, March 1999), and this method is widly used. By using this approach, I myself can produce osteoclasts with more than a hundred nuclei. I remind of you that, do not like primary cells, you do not need to use M-CSF in this model. sRANKL alone is enough.作者: langlang 时间: 2015-7-11 17:54
The purpose of countstain the cells with Hematoxylin is to see nuclei. Nuclei are blue labelled by Hematoxylin, not the color what you mentioned. Your are right, countstaining is not necessary for there is no problem to see nuclei without this step.
What is the cat# of Sigma kit you are using? I used to use 386/7-A but I do not like it.作者: 555444 时间: 2015-7-11 17:57
I made sRANKL by myself so does not matter how big the cell culture vehicle used. However,if you purchase RANKL you should use 8-well chambered slides, of course depends on what is the purpose of your experiments. For instance, if you want to extract RNA from the cells, you have to use dishes otherwise you would not have enough products. If you want to see osteoclasteogenesis, I think either 8-well chambered slides or 48-well plate will do.
For 60-mm Petri-dishes, 4 ml medium/dish.
I know commercial RANKL is very expensive, around 180USD/10ug.作者: 555444 时间: 2015-7-11 17:58
The purpose of countstain the cells with Hematoxylin is to see nuclei. Nuclei are blue labelled by Hematoxylin, not the color what you mentioned. You are right, countstaining is not necessary.
What is the cat# of Sigma kit you are using? I used to use 386/7-A but I do not like it.作者: dog002 时间: 2015-7-11 17:58
(1) when you plate RAW264.7 cells, you add sRANKL. (same time).
(2) cells will stop to proliferate when sRANKL is added, so your problem is not a problem.
(3) the reason you have this problem (cells still dividing when RANKL added) is: your raw264.7 cells are too old (i mean the generation).作者: DCS 时间: 2015-7-11 18:01
前辈
非常感谢阿,bow~~~
cell still dividing when RANKL add,除了the cell generation is too old(我用的是15代,应该多少代之前比较好呢?) 是否还有因为我加了M-CSF? 这个cytokine可以让osteoclast precursor分裂。
...
There is no any difference with/without M-CSF, but M-CSF is not necessary.
Passage <20 should be ok for osteoclasteogenesis.作者: DCS 时间: 2015-7-11 18:02
if cells partially dying from D2, it is a good phenomenon (RANKL effectively). your cells dying of overgrew (D9), no good.
check either your cells or the qulity of your RANKL. (I guess something wrong in your cells)作者: DCS 时间: 2015-7-11 18:09
这次我用12well plate, 10^6cell/well, from D2,0.5ml培养液的那个well,有好多细胞dying, 我不知道还要不要继续这个well.作者: DCS 时间: 2015-7-11 18:09
plate是 12well plate, 我就是在这个plate里面,同时做了control (treat nothing),都是10^6cell/well, 但是分成0.75ml 0.5ml 两个情况,对于每个情况分别treated with 100ng/150ng/ml, 但是三天后都没有明显的fusion. 并且 在0.5ml的well里面分别有一个加了cytokine的和没有加 cytokine的well里面大量细胞在第二天死掉。
还有我用的是humanRANKL, is that ok? I saw some paper they use hRANKL.
非常感谢前辈,对我很有帮助!!!
BOW~~~~~作者: 555444 时间: 2015-7-11 18:11
We have used cells from different sources as osteoclast precursors.
When we used RAW cells, we never count the number of cells. of course you can count. this is the tricky: cells should initially cover the bottom of the well, let's say, 80-90% confluent, does not matter what kind of plate used.作者: DCS 时间: 2015-7-11 18:12